emergency bivy ?

[DougPaul]

I need to weigh my current tarp and old bivy bag to see if the sil/nylon upgrades make sense. With a couple contractor bags as ground cover, the layers and gear I normally bring and the tarp or bivy - I guess me or my injured partner would be pretty comfortable for a while.

If you are in a windy location, I suspect the bags will be easier to use than flat tarps. And a little extra room in a plastic bag may enable one to ventilate a bit to reduce the moisture build-up.

BTW, Campmor is a good source of (relatively) inexpensive flat sil-nylon tarps. http://www.campmor.com/outdoor/gear...y=&searchKeywords=ultralight+backpacking+tarp

Doug

 

[erugs]

Unlike a plastic bag, the American Medical bivys are said to reflect 90% of your body heat. They also can be adjusted for opening size at the foot and are brightly colored (orange, or the metalic lining side) if you hope to be spotted.

 

[Chip]

Unlike a plastic bag, the American Medical bivys are said to reflect 90% of your body heat.

Understood. I wouldn't be using the bags as the bivy. I think the bags are good multi-purpose equipment as pack liners, emergency rain gear, waterproof ground cover and potentially as a small shelter/tarp.

The claims of "reflecting 90% of body heat' strike me as dubious, and I'm afraid some winter hikers may place too much faith in the abilty of a $30 item to be enough protection. Which is why, when I go through this exercise, I often end up with an overnight pack of gear for a day hike.

 

[erugs]

Here's the link to the interesting and free Practical Backpacking podcast interview with Adventure Medical about their bivys. Maybe it is hype? http://www.practicalbackpacking.com/audio/pbpodcast/PBP-39_AMK-Emergency-Blankets-and-Bivvies.mp3

 

[erugs]

My link didn't work. Try this, Eposode 39. http://www.practicalbackpacking.com/blog/

 

[DougPaul]

Understood. I wouldn't be using the bags as the bivy. I think the bags are good multi-purpose equipment as pack liners, emergency rain gear, waterproof ground cover and potentially as a small shelter/tarp.

One could, if need be, bivy using plastic bags. One over one's legs and one over the upper body (cut out a hole for one's head and neck).

The claims of "reflecting 90% of body heat' strike me as dubious, and I'm afraid some winter hikers may place too much faith in the abilty of a $30 item to be enough protection.

They may reflect 90% of the radiant heat and even reduce the convection, but do little to reduce the conduction. I view them as water and wind barriers to be placed around one's insulation. In winter, I include a full-length closed cell pad and at least a down jacket and fleece pants for insulation under and inside the bivy bag.

Doug

 

[DougPaul]

Here's the link to the interesting and free Practical Backpacking podcast interview with Adventure Medical about their bivys. Maybe it is hype? http://www.practicalbackpacking.com/audio/pbpodcast/PBP-39_AMK-Emergency-Blankets-and-Bivvies.mp3

My link didn't work.

Works for me.

Doug

 

[WinterWarlock]

(cut out a hole for one's head and neck).

It might be temporarily warmer if you forget this step, but I'm sure it's highly recommended.

With all the talk of bivy's, do any of you actually carry a sleeping bag, too? or do you use the bivy/down clothing?

 

[erugs]

Unless I am leading a trip where it is required, I usually have "walking wounded" extra warm gear rather than a sleeping bag that could get me through a night.

 

[DougPaul]

A correction:

I carry an Adventure Medical Kit emergency bivy (an earlier version of this): http://www.rei.com/product/750944 and a couple of plastic garbage bags.

I only carry something similar to the above in warm weather. In colder weather, I carry the Adventure Medical Kit Thermo-Lite Bivy: http://www.rei.com/product/750938.

(This is also what I used following my BC ski accident.)

Doug

 

[DougPaul]

(cut out a hole for one's head and neck).

It might be temporarily warmer if you forget this step, but I'm sure it's highly recommended.

Particularly if you don't want to suffocate...

Breathing inside your insulation or bivy sack may be warmer for a short period, but your exhaled moisture will condense in your gear. Very dangerous in the longer term.

With all the talk of bivy's, do any of you actually carry a sleeping bag, too? or do you use the bivy/down clothing?

Depends on a number of factors. (The following is for winter.) If solo and would only bivy in case of an emergency, the weight is a significant problem and I usually just carry the down jacket and insulating pants mentioned in my previous post (#26). (This gear would be required for any extended stop.) If I'm planning a bivy or in a group, then I'm more likely to take a sleeping bag. In either case I carry a full-length closed cell pad. Groups, of course, have the advantage that they can share the emergency gear (if they stay together).

I've also brought a sleeping bag with the intent of leaving it in the car. If one of us is hurt, one of the others may be able to retrieve the bag and bring it back to the accident scene.

Doug

 

[Stash]

With all the talk of bivy's, do any of you actually carry a sleeping bag, too? or do you use the bivy/down clothing?

20 degree bag in winter for day hike. plus a down vest and extra thermies. I've held off on a pad for day trips but will likely add it this year. It certainly makes sense

The older I get, the smarter I get, I guess.

 

[jniehof]

With all the talk of bivy's, do any of you actually carry a sleeping bag, too? or do you use the bivy/down clothing?

Summer, just extra clothing. Shoulder season, add closed-cell pad. Late shoulder season or winter, add bivy. If leading/co-leading, make sure there's a full-length pad regardless of season and a 20 degree bag in winter.

 

[DougPaul]

I've held off on a pad for day trips but will likely add it this year.

A closed cell pad also makes a good magazine splint. I've stabilized a knee with a ligament injury with one. (Fortunately not my knee...)

Doug

 

[Chip]

I doubt many people own a a closed cell pad or better yet a more modern Evazote foam pad. They are light, cheap, small, can be used as back pack padding, sat on and laid on for superior insulation. I think they are more important than the other components we're discussing for emergency winter survival (assuming you're carrying the recommended winter layers and change of base layer, to begin with).

 

[sardog1]

I doubt many people own a a closed cell pad or better yet a more modern Evazote foam pad. They are light, cheap, small, can be used as back pack padding, sat on and laid on for superior insulation. I think they are more important than the other components we're discussing for emergency winter survival (assuming you're carrying the recommended winter layers and change of base layer, to begin with).

It's a Western thang, you wouldn' unnerstan'. Seriously, I think the respective ratio of closed cell pads to hikers varies between .85 in the Northwest to mebbe .15 or less in the Northeast. Carrying one was the first important lesson I learned in Washington.

 

[DougPaul]

I doubt many people own a a closed cell pad or better yet a more modern Evazote foam pad. They are light, cheap, small, can be used as back pack padding, sat on and laid on for superior insulation. I think they are more important than the other components we're discussing for emergency winter survival (assuming you're carrying the recommended winter layers and change of base layer, to begin with).

While a foam pad is certainly important, don't forget the effect of cold wind. Something like a bivy sack or tent shell can be pretty much essential in such conditions.

BTW, Evazote is a brand of closed cell foam. http://www.qualityfoam.com/evazote.asp

Doug

 

[Little Rickie]

Do they sell them at Walmart? or any other chain store?

 

[Little Rickie]

Understood. I wouldn't be using the bags as the bivy. I think the bags are good multi-purpose equipment as pack liners, emergency rain gear, waterproof ground cover and potentially as a small shelter/tarp.

That's the ticket! Don't leave home without them. Keep some in the car as well...ya never know. They hold garbage too.

 

[Quietman]

Do they sell them at Walmart? or any other chain store?

Walmart Pad

I have one that I got at the EMS bargain basement 20 years ago. Despite a few rips and burn marks, it's still good. It's especially usefull when sleeping in a hammock in cooler weather, like next weekend.